In this episode of Stop the Noise, Susan Tatum sits down with Mike Richardson, a former Senior Vice President and CTO at Nationwide Insurance, who has seen both sides of the consulting equation—as a client hiring consultants and as a consultant himself. Mike shares invaluable insights into how independent consultants can successfully engage large organizations, navigate procurement processes, and differentiate themselves in a competitive landscape.
Notes from the Show
Big firms dominate generic services, but niche expertise wins. Independent consultants should focus on thought leadership and specialized knowledge rather than competing with large firms on standard services.
Understand the funding cycle. Many consulting budgets are locked in well in advance, so long-term relationship building is key to securing future opportunities.
Supplier management can be an ally. Building relationships with supplier management teams (formerly known as procurement) can help consultants gain access to decision-makers and understand company priorities.
Target mid-level executives. These individuals have the influence and knowledge to drive change within their organizations and can be key advocates for bringing in external consultants.
Tell a compelling story. Decision-makers remember stories, not statistics. Position yourself as someone who deeply understands their challenges and can make a tangible impact.
Quotes:
“If you tell a story rooted in solving pain points, rather than just sharing numbers, you stand a far better chance of winning the business.”
“The incumbent always wins unless there’s a really compelling reason to switch—be that reason.”
What’s Inside:
How do independent consultants land big-name clients?
Who to connect with to win influence.
Why you should never offer solutions based on assumptions.
Breaking past generic services to offer niche solutions.
Mentioned in this Episode:
Transcribed by AI Susan Tatum 0:38
Hey everybody, welcome back to stop the noise. Today my guest is Mike Richardson, who insists that he's retired, but it doesn't sound to me like he really is. He's the founder and CEO of the Richardson Leadership Group. The reason that I invited him here today is that he spent nearly 20 years as a Senior Vice President and CTO at Nationwide Insurance. He's seeing both sides of the consulting coin, client side and as an external consultant with some of the big firms. Welcome Mike. It's so good to have you here.
Mike Richardson 1:10
Well, thank you. I appreciate you having me.
Susan Tatum 1:13
So for the folks that aren't familiar with you, can you do a better job than I did of telling us about your background?
Mike Richardson 1:20
Yeah, as you said, I retired from Nationwide back in June of 2023 after about 19 years with the company. I had held multiple executive roles over that time, ultimately culminating in some various CIO and CTO roles. So specifically, I had led the personalized business as CIO, our enterprise applications organizations as a CIO, the financial services businesses as a CIO. We then relabeled CIOs to the CTOs, and our CTOs, the chief architects, a little name change in there. And then also, right before I left, I led an enterprise level organization focused on technology strategy at the enterprise data office as part of that innovation. So lots of different positions over my time with nationwide, I also spent time in consulting. I spent about seven years prior to nationwide with IBM. I had come up through the ranks at IBM, ultimately becoming an associate principal, and I did do sales as a competency associate principal that was aligned with industry principles. And then before that, I was with Coopers and library and at Anderson Consulting, working on projects primarily in different roles for them
Susan Tatum 2:30
I have a question to just to start this off, because I for the listeners this episode here is part of what I'm in my mind, is getting inside the heads of C level executives and trying to understand our prospects a little better. An easy question to kick this off, you mentioned CIO, and CTO, and I think that's something that so I was, my experience, mostly in the technology industry, was that the CTO was responsible for the technology that was in some product, lets say, a software product that they're selling, and the CIO was oversaw the technology that was used to run the company. But I've since heard that's not always true.
Mike Richardson 3:10
Yeah, in recent years, there's been a bit of a shift. Not every organization has made it. I don't know what percentage have, but a bit of a shift for retitling CIOs to CTOs so that it more accurately reflected the technology aspect, and not just Chief Information Officer, right, but a heavier emphasis on the technology components. And then what were traditional CTOs that oftentimes reported into CIOs organizations like nationwide, happened to retitle those over to chief architects to try to be more accurate and exactly what their responsibilities were in an organization.
Susan Tatum 3:44
So let us start this. Because I know the first conversation we had, you were very clear that nationwide does not hire off the outside of the big firms that you have contracts with. And I think if you could talk about that a little bit, because I think we could save some folks some time beating their heads against the wall trying to get through to something that's not going to work for them. So what advice do you have for an independent consultant that wants to work with the big guys?
Mike Richardson 4:17
Yeah, so a few different things, if I could delay or the conversation just a bit. So, yes, there is an order by which most large companies bring in consultants, and specifically, if you have, if you're offering, I should say, a generic set of services like, look, we've got project managers on my organization here. We've got, I don't know, architects, if you're working in the tech world, if you're doing basic development type of work in a technology org, then yeah, the big guys can supply all of that at reasonable rates, especially leveraging offshore so you tend to go with them to be able to get the volume discounts if you're offering. Services that are far more thought leadership oriented. As an independent consultant, you have far greater opportunity in that world. Or if you have a product that you're offering that has a particular niche to it, whether it fits within an entire ecosystem, or some standalone side component that you happen to be selling. So I often break it down into look, if you've got base, generic services that you're offering, it's going to be brutal for you to be able to compete and win at a large organization. You're better off subcontracting right out of a gate and then trying to get people to recognize you and your skills, skills within the company that you've got if you're offering something that's more niche, whether product or thought leadership, then you have a better shot at winning businessmmore specifically on your own. Does that make sense?
Susan Tatum 5:49
Okay? So then you're not saying it's impossible to do.
Mike Richardson 5:53
It is not impossible, but it is an uphill battle, because most companies, again, like my tiny nationwide I was, I would always look to the current firms that we were signed with. Can you provide this service? What thought leadership can you provide to us, and whatever types of work we happen to be providing? Now, there were others that could come in that had very specific knowledge, so get out of the tech world for a moment. Say that you're an independent and you've got a whole lot of experience in the actuarial world that's gold for an insurance company. Had to get that very broadly from many different suppliers.
Susan Tatum 6:30
Okay, all right, you mentioned generic. And I think that's some that's a thread I'd like to pull on a little bit more, because I see that up and down the ladder, doesn't matter really what the size of the firm is that a consultant is trying to work with generic gets you nowhere, because there's so much competition out there.
Mike Richardson 6:49
Yeah. Again, there are multiple components that I would call out too,
Susan Tatum 6:54
break it down.
Mike Richardson 6:55
Yeah, when we talk about generic, that even begins just with say, you've got the conversation going. You've got to start, whether it's been large firms or some of the independents that I had spoken to over time, use examples that are relevant to the business unit you're speaking to. And again, it is such a common mistake in consulting overall, where, again, doesn't matter who it is, what size firm they're coming from, they would come in, when I was leading financial services and share a bunch of examples that were property and casualty specific. Nationwide got a dozen business units to it. You're going to lose interest if you're trying to talk to the life business or annuity business, and you're using examples from the small commercial property and casualty but it just doesn't resonate. So first is get your examples clear, and once you have clear examples, go beyond the industry generics that I call it, where everybody will talk about fraud and insurance, or everybody will talk about claims. Talk to me about some of the more obscure back end processes that really need to be better than they are within most companies, help us think about those, not just the big ticket ones that everybody talks about. So that's one aspect of being specific. Does that make sense?
Susan Tatum 8:10
Absolutely, and could you give us, I think you just give an example, but as a CTO or a CIO, or whatever we're going to call it, what are the types of things that you didn't see people talking about that were on your radar.
MikeRichardson 8:23
Again, it was, well, here's the thing, everybody was talking about everything. So that's why podcast is so relevant, right? Everybody's talking about everything. So how do you break through that? How do you stop that noise and actually get a message across? So it wasn't what people were weren't talking about. It's weather when you're speaking. Let me give you one other example. Financial Services, growing gangbusters and individual businesses, they may be more focused on increasing revenue than they are right growth than they are on expense management. Auto industry over the years, taking lots of hits. Right? The price of everything in a car has increased. So for them, while revenue growth is important, expense management is extremely important. So if you come into a conversation with the auto part of the insurance business, and you're talking all about growth and what they're worried about is expense management, you're going to miss. It's not to say [inaudible] not a lot to get about growth at all. It's just expense management is far more important. If you flip that and you're in financial services and you're having a conversation around expense management, their primary concern nationwide over those years was primarily growth. So you can just sound out of tune and lose the opportunity.
Susan Tatum 9:38
Do your research, do your homework
Mike Richardson 9:40
the priorities of each of those business units that you're gonna speak with, and tailor your message to each of them.
Susan Tatum 9:45
So if I was trying to get to well, let's just say to you, and I wanted to understand what your priorities are, where would I go to get that information?
Mike Richardson 9:56
Yeah, so, and now we're talking about influencers, right? Right? So how do you know who the influencers are, and how do you get after them? So the first thing I would say is, obviously it's always easier if you're already on the inside, you can learn and figure out who the influencers are. So again, for independence, I would often counsel and say, I think you should subcontract for a while and then try to break out as people learn you, whether it's your thought leadership, or whatever product that you have to offer that could fit within the work and the needs of the organization. So minus that, let's assume that you're not in the organization and you have a subcontracted always begins with the supplier management team. Build a relationship with that team, because they can help get you to the right people, or prevent you from getting to the right people. Obviously, they receive a lot of requests, so you have to have some kind of story about you that resonates with them.
Susan Tatum 10:49
So this is supplier management. Is like procurement that we would have called years ago. So supplier management is a much nicer term for it is
Mike Richardson 10:58
it's a broader term. Yes, it's a part of the overall supplier management team Yeah.
Susan Tatum 11:02
So their priorities are a little bit different than what your priorities would be, or what the budget owner or the manager whatever would be looking for.
Mike Richardson 11:11
I think priorities diverge later in the process, so specifically early on, everybody, I think, is trying to figure out what the best solutions are, what the best options are for whichever part of the business that you're talking about, right? I think supplier management, and that's why it's more than just procurement. They're doing their jobs well. They're helping to identify different companies and individuals that can help meet the needs of those business units and all the supporting areas like technology. I think all of that is consistent up front, where it starts to diverge later is when you get into the usual. Well, now let's talk price, and then they take on the pure procurement role of, let me beat you about the head and shoulders until you cave right, while everybody else is like, look, we want to get moving. We've already made the decision. This is what we want to do. So I think it diverges at a point. But if you ignore supplier management up front, I think you do that at your own risk, because even if they aren't heavy influencers in an organization you happen to be talking to, they certainly can be a roadblock.
Susan Tatum 12:08
Would they be a good source of information if you make friends with them, if you approach it correctly,
Mike Richardson 12:12
absolutely no question about it. I saw some wonderful people on the supplier management team at Nationwide that would bring things forward to my team. Said, Hey, I was either at this conference or I had lunch with this person. Had a conversation. I learned this. I think it's something you might be interested in. Don't know exactly how it fits in, but have a conversation. No question about it. That's why I start with them.
Susan Tatum 12:33
That makes a lot of sense. You mentioned also the importance of telling a story to help differentiate you What? What? Tell me more about that,
Mike Richardson 12:43
and I'll link this into some of the influencer component here too, right? So people can remember stories, they can't remember facts, figures or charts, right? Try to look at a bunch of PowerPoint slides that have all these figures out of and then five minutes after the meeting, I want you to repeat to me what those slides told you most people
Susan Tatum 13:00
it was a green bar and a yellow bar, and it
Mike Richardson 13:04
went pretty good because the Green was higher than red, so that makes it right. But you know so. But if I asked you to repeat the story of The Three Bears, even though you probably have not read it in forever, you'd probably hear it on it right. So here's the point, if you tell a story that is rooted in pain points, in removing those pain points, in other words, making things easy, rather than trying to share revenue and expense numbers. And I'm not saying not to do that. I'm saying, begin with the story. Take the position. Say you are customers. You're going to do something in call center, and you're working with customer service reps, and here's how you fit into the bigger picture of all the work that goes on for customer service. Reps tell the story of what their day to day work looks like, and how you're going to help make that easier and better, and then share how there happens to be either some revenue growth or expense benefit that comes from that people miss the storytelling that allows me, as a decision maker, with my team of decision makers, to fair it out and say, how are these people different? How are these organizations different? They all had about the same numbers. They all had about the same expense approach. Well, now back to price, supplier management. Go after them. Tell a story. You got a far better chance to win. And I
Susan Tatum 14:19
think you're hitting on two other points there to Mike, because, yeah, we remember stories. That's how humans have communicated forever. But it's also we know that buyers buy on emotion and justify with facts. And so if you can get somebody bought in on your story, and there's an emotional so you were describing, what is this person's day like? Now I can feel that you get me when you start telling me that you know what my day is like. Now we have a sort of an emotional connection. Then I can justify it with numbers later, that's
Mike Richardson 14:51
right. And one of the things that I believe is of utmost importance is to demonstrate that you are considering. The business first, the company you're going to work with, first, and your needs second. And it comes clear. I mean, it comes through clear as day, when the story is about you rather than about those that you're trying to help, right? So two things to that. One, you got to make sure that it's about them. It ain't about you now, separate from that, even though it ain't about you, have to be able to clearly articulate why you and I've asked Seattle buddy firms this question. Again, I mostly worked with larger organizations, but even the mid size that I worked with, I've done a little consulting with a couple of smaller companies, and said why you and it is so hard for people to answer that question, but if you don't know, then I don't know you. You happen off
Susan Tatum 15:44
the top of your head to have an example of a really good answer to that question that you heard from someone before, or you've used
Mike Richardson 15:50
I will give I'm going to make it just a bit more generic. Okay, okay, so this was related to and again, this one was one of our mid sized partners. And there was a conversation that was going on around some application development work, again, that was more of a generic set of work that oftentimes you can use the larger firms for to get the greater price discounts. But they were trying to break in to some of that type of work, and they were talking to me about we got great project management, and we know applications like this, all this stuff. And I'm like, so do they? So do the other company, and they gave me some very specific early indications on how they could do some modeling that would relate to future artificial intelligence needs that nobody else was describing talking about that was a winning underlying everything else was pretty generic in terms of what they were offering, but this component that others were not speaking to. So it's not like everything you do has to be complete, completely unique, but you got to be able to say why you so that I can say why I want to go with you. And
Susan Tatum 17:01
a good point that you're underlying what you're talking about there is if the the incumbent is always going to win, if there's not a better reason, a really good reason, to go with somebody else. I mean, it's like the old nobody got fired for buying IBM or whatever it was that year. We've got this company in here. We've got a contract with them. You're not, I'm not going to get in trouble for hiring them if I believe they can do what they say they can do. So you've got to have a really good reason to switch, that's right.
Mike Richardson 17:30
And then you need to be able to describe it to those influencers. So if I can go back for just a second to the influencers, because I think that part of it is so important too. We talked about starting with supplier management. But if you're coming from the outside, look for the mid level executives. They're the ones, especially the newer one. They're the ones that still have enough of the day to day. Know how, whether that's in my world technology, know how, of how things actually work, or within a business unit, of how those processes actually work. But go for the mid level executives, because they know what works, what doesn't, and how solutions are stitched together. Those are the ones like in our world, those chief architects, they tend to be influencers. Look for the direct reports of the people or the person that you think you should be talking to. So if you think you should be talking to one of the CIOs, who are my direct reports, and exactly what do they do? Because they're going to have the conversations before I do. If you came to me with something out of the blue, I'm going to send you right back to I might have a conversation. Say that sounds interesting. Here's where I want you to go. But am I going to make a decision with that conversation? Another one look for who's running the large projects. People usually don't put their lowest performing associates and leaders on the largest, most complex work they've got. They put their stars on those things, and those are people that can be influential. So ultimately, if you know the needs of the business units, and you know the pressures, and you're showing that you get what's happening in their world through the stories that you're telling, you can tell why you and you know who to convince first to that list that I just kind of ran down you got a much better shot than the others that don't do those things.
Susan Tatum 19:08
My mind is just going in 1000 directions on the information that you're giving us here. I know that the best way in is to have somebody, if I wanted to talk to a middle manager, it would be somebody that I know, that knows them, that can do an introduction. Do you ever, under any circumstances, respond to an email or something that comes out of the blue from somebody that you don't know?
Mike Richardson 19:30
Sometimes what I didn't respond to? I'll start with that. Were emails that were, hey, we were on your website. We saw these problems. We could fix those for you. For the most part, we know what the problems are. They just haven't been a priority. So you are now addressing a non priority item for me through an email. That's a losing proposition, right? Or so that kind of stuff, again, generic doesn't win. Emails that are like, Oh, hey, I met the CEO, and that was cool. I'd like to talk to you all right? Everybody knows. Somebody name dropping like that doesn't work. But if you're like, hey, I met the CEO, we were having a conversation around this particular problem, and I happen to have history with that and a lot of thought leadership, yeah, I'm gonna give you a call. Even if you hadn't met the CEO, if you're just you're targeted, and what you're saying if it's relevant. But again, you gotta know those priorities a little bit. I would say most people love to talk about their work and themselves. Take them to lunch. Find those mid level executives, like I said, Right? Find the ones that are newer and that have a lot that, from promotion wise, have a lot that they're looking to get done to prove themselves. Take them to lunch. They'll rattle off 50 things in one lunch that you can pick up on in terms of who the others are you should reach out to.
Susan Tatum 20:43
I think that you have to have a really good reason to take them to lunch. I mean, excuse me, there's got to be some value for them to give you that time, right? They're not looking for free lunch. I don't know.
Mike Richardson 20:53
I'm a firm believer. Now, everybody is busy, so that's within this context of everybody's busy. But it doesn't take a ton to look at LinkedIn and say, I see you work in this organization. I see these are the types of comments that you're making out there. I would be interested in learning from you. Can I buy you lunch? Lots of people you know are willing to help people learn right now they're exercising, literally have no idea who you are, and all you did was say, can I come by the office? That's not as helpful, but if it's in a relaxed atmosphere, like, can I take it up conferences? Everybody knows that conferences are great if you actually make the right use of them. If you're looking up saying, Do I have the list? Can I see who's with which organizations and what roles they hold? Do my solutions fit, and what specifically could I say to each of them? You can bump into them and say, Can I buy you a coffee and have a conversation? I got nowhere else to be anyways, it's a conference. They're there for the duration.
Susan Tatum 21:51
Yeah. I mean, that's the whole you gotta have a plan. When you go through these things, you gotta have a plan. You gotta have a plan. I think that that's interesting. What you're talking about there, because I think I have observed that many people, many consultants, they tend to not want to ask for help, because, for some reason, they think they have to know everything and there, and it makes them look weak if they ask for help. But it works. I mean, people, as you said, people want to help you. They want to help others, and it makes them feel good.
Mike Richardson 22:24
What people want are the right solutions that are fastest and easiest to implement, whether those are process changes, organization changes, technology changes, right they want them to be right. So to give you the best information is helpful for the organization, because this is always one thing I caution consultants on also, is you better watch the assumptions you make, because you've got an opportunity to at least ask so that they're not assumptions. And if you're showing me a bunch of stuff based on assumptions that are just totally wrong, you lose right, and you have the opportunity to say I was I assume it was this. I go, No, that's actually not true. Or the people on my team, whoever would tell you that
Susan Tatum 23:07
I have heard that from other C level executives, that they get really annoyed when somebody makes an assumption that assumes that they know what the priorities are without asking about it because we're usually wrong. We do something like that,
Mike Richardson 23:24
I think, yeah, but flip it around, right? Well, language is everything. Words matter. Hey, just want to confirm, I believe I heard this in one of the meetings. Is this actually accurate for this business unit, as it sounds a lot like this other one, or just, more simply, just want to confirm that what I heard is correct. Is this your understanding, too? Most people aren't going to go, I'm not telling you. They're trying to get the best answers. They're going to tell you, the
Susan Tatum 23:45
days of hiding the information are over, aren't they? That's why I so I have, like, three pages of things I want to talk to you about, and we're running out of time, and I'm still on page one. This has been fantastic. I thank you so much. And is there anything? Because I know we didn't get to some of the stuff on this fabulous list that we have. Is there anything that you want to make sure our listeners are aware of?
Mike Richardson 24:10
I would just emphasize a couple of points that I already made. Number one is demonstrate you have the company's best interests at heart, and that takes time. You need to know, generally, you need to know the funding cycle of the company. If you have a company that is on an annual funding cycle like many still are, then decisions have been made. Large projects have been carried over from one year to the next. So you think there's a huge budget, but what you don't know is 85% of it's already locked in and carry over work and other decisions that were just made. There's only 15% available. So often, what you're really trying to do is get in on the next year's budget, and that takes time, right? So you gotta work with people to understand that. You gotta work with people to influence them, as we talked about, toward your solution. So have the company's best interest at heart and demonstrate that. Know the. Funding cycle, so that you're not seeming unreasonable to people are like, I don't have the money right now. It doesn't come free until next year. We'll talk about it as we get deeper, right and then, yeah, I guess just long term relationships. If you're trying to hop from site to site, it's going to be really difficult to have tremendous success, I think anywhere.
Susan Tatum 25:20
Yeah, oh, well, there's that trust factor that has to be built this. These are relationships, and it's not like they're not buying a product they can return if they're buying consulting services. I think that patience can be difficult for some of us, myself included, but it's something that we have to practice. What do you have an estimate of like? So I did see some stats that said the average consulting project takes three to six months from the first conversation, when the opportunity first exhibits itself and you have that first conversation, some of them go much longer. I think I hear you saying, this could be years that you're working on building these relationships to get in the door.
Mike Richardson 26:01
Well, okay, but again, it depends on the solution that you're offering. So I always have to go back to that. If you're offering generic skills, then you might as well subcontract, and people are going to pull you in as things are already starting. And that's not going to take much of your own personal time, right? If you're offering a specific niche set of skills, a specific set of thought leadership that's higher up in the strategy type of realm, or at least high level planning across a business area or any supporting area, then you're probably in that three to six month type of realm, if you're working but you have the niche skills or something special to offer and you're looking for larger project work, then, yeah, it can take a year for that project to start up because it's waiting its turn in the funding cycle. Yeah, if you have a product, totally depends on the scale of the implementation of that type of product.
Susan Tatum 26:52
Yeah. And it also speaks to understanding what, and this goes back to something you said earlier, what are the priorities inside this, that particular organization, where are the issues that they're spending money on? Because you're not going to sell anything. If they're like, Yeah, okay, it's just not that important. We're going to let that ride
Mike Richardson 27:12
Yeah. And the as you get the higher level priorities, then you can break those down. If you're going to find lots of organizations that will say, cyber security, high priority. Okay, there are dozens of components to cyber security. Which component of that is actually a high priority for you, right? So as you get toward or get deeper with influencers and stuff, you can be more nuanced, which, again, is going to help win if you know the nuances of those priorities, not just the highest level that I was providing as a starting point earlier in the conversation.
Susan Tatum 27:42
Yeah, so it's like going, I mean, I wouldn't say that cybersecurity is generic. It's an umbrella, and the more you focus on the parts within that umbrella, the more you have that tip of the spear to stand out, I think.
Mike Richardson 27:55
And again, supplier management can help you understand where the funding is. Dollars are being the dollars were already spent on this other area, so that part of under the umbrella is mostly good. The team is now focused on something different. So supplier management, they get hungry too. Take them to lunch.
Susan Tatum 28:11
That's awesome. Mike, thank you so much for sharing this with us, and gonna have to invite you to come back, because you've got, I know a lot of other stuff to talk about. Now that you're retired and have all of this time. Do you mind if some of the listeners follow up with you, if they have additional questions?
Mike Richardson 28:29
Yeah, that's absolutely fine. I did a podcast with Bolden for retirement planning, and I had a number of people follow up with me. After that one, it was really nice to meet so many different people and learn from them, as well as share my experiences. So happy to do that. If people want to reach out, they can, if they go to my site, they can get to the email I just go to the Richardson Group or the Richardson leadership, everybody should say, and they can get my email off of there. Just connect up if they'd like.
Susan Tatum 28:53
And you're Michael Richardson on LinkedIn, right. We'll put all this in the show notes, but yeah, all right. Well, once again. Thank you so much. And I can't wait to get this episode live, because it's chock full of good stuff.
Mike Richardson 29:06
Great. Thank you for having me again. I Do appreciate it. Take care. Bye, bye.